Raskol se zahuktava

[Orthophill]

https://bigorski.org.mk/vesti/svet/treba-li-da-se-ratifikuvaat-aktite-za-avtokefalija-od-vselenskata-patrijarshija/

https://bigorski.org.mk/slova/pouchni/praktikata-na-apelaciskoto-pravo-na-konstantinopolskite-patrijarsi/

Интересно је да Васеленска Патријаршија постављала и мењала Антиохијске и Александријске Патријархе исто као и Охридске Архиепископе. Да ли то значи да Антиохијска и Александријска Патријаршија су аутономни?

 

[Јанко]

On 22.1.2019. at 12:49, Давид рече

Да, могуће, мада је прекидао доста и питао за туђа мишљења, мсм није жена кренула на улицу да скупља мишљења већ он. :P
Aли кључ за сваку анкету данас:

Не могу да се отмем утиску да је режирано.

Наилази и све ово прича, он као против али наставља...

А жена има МАСКУ преко лица (граница гумене маске преко чела, обрве дебеле испод гуме, оловком преко нацртане танке, горња усна се неприродно смежура кад прича, капа је ту да прикрије праву косу и ову границу на челу).

Можда сам одлепио, можда је само изоперисана и изботоксирана, а можда...

[Давид]

пре 9 часа, Јанко рече

Не могу да се отмем утиску да је режирано.

Наилази и све ово прича, он као против али наставља...

А жена има МАСКУ преко лица (граница гумене маске преко чела, обрве дебеле испод гуме, оловком преко нацртане танке, горња усна се неприродно смежура кад прича, капа је ту да прикрије праву косу и ову границу на челу).

Можда сам одлепио, можда је само изоперисана и изботоксирана, а можда...

Хахахах. Није да није.

[Ведран*]

Ево какав утисак остављамо по свету...

https://cerkvarium.org/ru/novosti/pomestnye-tserkvi/v-serbskoj-tserkvi-konflikt-iz-za-ukrainskoj-avtokefalii.html?fbclid=IwAR30uVT1V3VDbcUXHoaLDgpd87MkaB3SakR1f1fmeYL02CJvJU6cycePDOQ

 

[Milan Nikolic]

Зизјулас је у својим радовима наглашавао да националност у Цркви је ближа паклу ако се користи на начин, као што га сада користи Цариград са Украјином.

[MKD13]

https://www.romfea.gr/epikairotita-xronika/26631-arxiepiskopos-kuprou-den-biazometha-alla-oute-tha-mpagiatepsei-an-den-kalesoume-amesos-ton-epifanio

Arhiepiskop Kiparski Hrizostom je podrzao Carigradsku Patriarsiju... kaze  da ce po svaku cenu odrzavati tesne bratske veze koje imaju ove dve crkve i pored toga sto neki pokusavaju da stvore probleme...

Jos je reko da ce Mitropolit Kijevski Epifanije, kad doge vreme za to,  biti pozvan na Kipru i da ce saluzivati sa njime.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=190&v=vab5xSlzE5M

 

[Тихон]

@Ведран*  НВО. Центар религиозне безбедности (или да га скратимо на ЦРБ).

[o. Miroljub]

пре 4 часа, Ведран* рече

Ево какав утисак остављамо по свету...

https://cerkvarium.org/ru/novosti/pomestnye-tserkvi/v-serbskoj-tserkvi-konflikt-iz-za-ukrainskoj-avtokefalii.html?fbclid=IwAR30uVT1V3VDbcUXHoaLDgpd87MkaB3SakR1f1fmeYL02CJvJU6cycePDOQ

 

 

Где и када је +Максим ово изјавио? У тексту интервјуа на теологија.нет тога нема. Укронацисти му оваквом импутацијом само одмажу.

 

Епископ Максим в интервью порталу «Теология» сравнил получения Украиной церковной независимости с первой сербской автокефалией. Он заявил, что в византийских источниках нет Томоса об автокефалии, который вроде бы выдал патриарх Мануил архиепископу Савве. Никто не оставил свидетельств о том, что видел этот Томос, он должен быть по крайней мере в протоколе или кодексе ‒ продолжает епископ Максим. Однако ни года его выдачи, ни условий, ни даже кто именно его подписал, точно не известно.

В сербской историографии есть много «творческих» объяснений этому, однако неизменным остается вопрос «Где этот Томос?».

 

[Ведран*]

пре 4 часа, Тихон рече

@Ведран*  НВО. Центар религиозне безбедности (или да га скратимо на ЦРБ).

Да. Тај Церкваријум је основан с пропагандним циљем. То отворено и сами кажу. 

[Ведран*]

пре 4 часа, o. Miroljub рече

 

Где и када је +Максим ово изјавио? У тексту интервјуа на теологија.нет тога нема. Укронацисти му оваквом импутацијом само одмажу.

 

Епископ Максим в интервью порталу «Теология» сравнил получения Украиной церковной независимости с первой сербской автокефалией. Он заявил, что в византийских источниках нет Томоса об автокефалии, который вроде бы выдал патриарх Мануил архиепископу Савве. Никто не оставил свидетельств о том, что видел этот Томос, он должен быть по крайней мере в протоколе или кодексе ‒ продолжает епископ Максим. Однако ни года его выдачи, ни условий, ни даже кто именно его подписал, точно не известно.

В сербской историографии есть много «творческих» объяснений этому, однако неизменным остается вопрос «Где этот Томос?».

 

Па и нема тога код в. Максима. То су ови из Церкваријума сами накачили да је Максим рекао, ради јачег ефекта. 

Само, остаје то да чим су чули један глас који им иде у прилог, направили су причу о великом сукобу у СПЦ. 

Ја мислим да наши архипастири нарочито у овоме тренутку мора да буду изузетно мудри да не смеју да дозволе да овај проблем код нас изазове раздор. 

[Ведран*]

Само дане заборавимо кроз какав свакодневни хаос, "захваљујући" деловању пат. Вартоломеја, пролази народ Украјине који припада канонској Цркви...

 

 

[MKD13]

Mitropolit Galski Emanuil, koji je vozglavio obedinujuci Sabor u Kievu na kome je izbran Kijevski mitropolit Epifanije i osnovana PCU, za Bogojavljenje boravio na Svetu Goru i sasluzivao sa otcima manastira Pantokrator.

https://www.romfea.gr/agioritika-nea/26515-o-mitropolitis-gallias-sto-agion-oros-foto

 

[Ведран*]

Митрополит Калист се опет огласио. Овај пут на конфернцији у Румунији.

Говорио је о примату, сабору на Криту, и о ситуацији на Украјини. 

http://orthochristian.com/118691.html 

 

[Ромејац]

MT. ATHOS DIVIDED OVER UKRAINE ISSUE, SOURCE SAYS

Though many Athonite monks are “extremely negative” about the recent actions of the Patriarchate of Constantinople in Ukraine, there is no consensus on the Mountain, a source close to the monastic communities told RIA-Novosti yesterday.

“Athonite monks—at least in personal conversations—are very negative about this. But there has been no official decision about it yet,” the source said, answering the question of what kind of attitude prevails on the Holy Mountain towards Constantinople’s new Ukrainian “church.”

The Holy Kinot, the ruling body on the Mountain, will probably meet soon to discuss the issue—perhaps yet in January or in February, the source said.

Despite many personal negative feelings, “There are, of course, monasteries and some sentiments that support the Patriarchate of Constantinople’s actions.” A hieromonk and calligrapher of Xenophontos, one of the 20 ruling monasteries on the Mountain, prepared the tomos of autocephaly that Patriarch Bartholomew gave to the Ukrainian schismatics, with the blessing of Abbot Alexios of Xenophontos.

Asked whether there could be a division on the Holy Mountain about the issue, the source noted that “It is quite likely that there will be.”

As a whole, however, the monasteries might simply condemn Constantinople’s interference in Ukraine without taking any further actions.

It was reported in November that several Greek monasteries on Mt. Athos added a special petition to the Litany of Peace in all of their services to specifically pray for His Beatitude Metropolitan Onuphry of Kiev and All Ukraine, the head of the canonical Ukrainian Church, and for his much-suffering flock.

“We know that the majority of the abbots of the Athonite monasteries do not agree with the anti-canonical decisions of the Phanar,” His Eminence Metropolitan Anthony of Boryspil and Bovary, the Chancellor of the Ukrainian Orthodox Church, said at that time.

Though no official response has come from the Sacred Community yet, individual abbots have spoken out over the past few years, most recently Archimandrite Parthenios (Murelatos), one of the oldest inhabitants of the Holy Mountain and the abbot of the Monastery of St. Paul, who expressed his belief that the Ukrainian Church should maintain its unity with the Moscow Patriarchate.

Also, in March 2015, when Met. Onuphry was visiting Mt. Athos, Archimandrite Ephraim of Vatopedi stated, “With a heavy heart I am anxious about the present state of Ukraine and from Holy Mount Athos I am asking the Ukrainian people to remain faithful to the canonical Church, the canonical primate and the canonical Synod. We want Ukrainian residents to support the canonical Church. It is important for one’s salvation to obey the canonical Church.”

And in an address to the Ukrainian people in 2017, Fr. Ephraim noted that the issue affects all of Mt. Athos, saying the Holy Mountain is very grieved about the schism in the Ukrainian Orthodox Church. According to the abbot, the schism cuts like scissors, and he who went into schism must understand that he is outside of the fold of the Church. “If someone is outside of the Church … he cannot attain holiness,” he said.

“Therefore, we entreat all of our brothers who have left the canonical Church, we appeal and we entreat that they would return to the womb of the canonical Orthodox Church,” the elder said.

http://orthochristian.com/118875.html?fbclid=IwAR0Hmm2zyvNoCiNf3gd-Lvu5g2T981aAsPIg19bwwJktTbK6DAfEc15KnE8

[Ромејац]

ABP. CHRYSOSTOMOS OF CYPRUS WILL NOT COMMEMORATE HEAD OF UKRAINIAN SCHISMATICS

 

Nicosia, Cyprus, January 9, 2019

Finding himself in a position where he again had to refute misinformation coming from the Ukrainian Ministry of Foreign Affairs, His Beatitude Archbishop Chrysostomos of Cyprus stressed that he rejected a proposed visit from “Metropolitan” Epiphany Dumenko, the head of the new Ukrainian schismatic structure, and that he had not and will not commemorate him at the Divine Liturgy.

His Beatitude met with the Ukrainian ambassador to Cyprus Boris Gumenyuk today, after which Cypriot media, referencing sources in the Ukrainian embassy, reported that Abp. Chrysostomos spoke in favor of autocephaly in Ukraine, reports the Greek news agency Romfea.

The site of the canonical Ukrainian Orthodox Church reports that such information appeared on the site of the Ukrainian Ministry of Foreign Affairs as well, stating: “The head of the Cypriot Orthodox Church confirmed his position on the right of Ukraine to have its own independent autocephalous Church and wished the Ukrainian people peace and goodness.”

Romfea then contacted His Beatitude, who denied the information coming from the Ukrainian embassy.

He emphasized that “every state has the right to autocephaly, and it depends on the Ukrainian people, but, nevertheless, at the moment I see that the Ukrainian people have not aroused themselves to such actions.”

He also noted that “while it is not of paramount importance to provide autocephaly, it is important that there be no division in Orthodoxy.”

In conclusion, Abp. Chrysostomos noted that he had been contacted about the possibility of Epiphany Dumenko visiting Cyprus, which he flatly refused. He also stressed that he has not and will not commemorate him at the Divine Liturgy.

At a meeting with the same ambassador in September, the Cypriot primate “expressed his worry and concern about the latest events in the Ukrainian Church and the possibility of the creation of a schism that would harm the unity of all Orthodoxy.”

However, the Ukrainian Ministry of Foreign Affairs also misrepresented Abp. Chrysostomos’ words at that time to make him out to be a supporter of the Ecumenical Patriarchate’s granting of autocephaly to Ukrainian schismatics. The reports that made the rounds in Ukrainian media differed markedly from that on the official page of the Church of Cyprus.

At that time, the Cypriot primate expressed his willingness to serve as a mediator in the situation, though since then it has become clear that the Patriarchate of Constantinople is not interested in discussing the matter, having disregarded the warning of numerous Synods, primates, and hierarchs.

In early October, Abp. Chrysostomos also noted that he is opposed to political interference in Ukrainian Church affairs, though politicians have been the main players in the autocephaly process.

Thus far, Patriarch Bartholomew’s request to every primate to recognize the new Ukrainian nationalist-schismatic structure and to commemorate “Metropolitan” Epiphany has been rejected by the Polish and Serbian Churches, and the Antiochian Church, which again called for a pan-Orthodox council to discuss the matter (though Pat. Bartholomew again refused). The Greek Holy Synod declined to fulfill Pat. Bartholomew’s request, instead referring it on for further consideration by the broader Bishops’ Council.

According to an informed source within the Church of the Czech Lands and Slovakia, that Church’s Synod also will not recognize the Ukrainian schismatics, though the Synod has yet to meet and make its official decision.

http://orthochristian.com/118512.html?fbclid=IwAR1XxiJXZ3EcYeOlXPrc3GkR_DULAHAHmluXQlRLB_ziNIzJi87FkjmpNbE