Ruski avion oboren na granici Turske i Sirije

[МилошБГ]

20.00 - Руска ракетна крстарица "Москва" креће ка обалама Сирије. Тај брод има одбрамбени потенцијал који представља еквивалент систему С-300, саопштило руско министарство одбране. Од сада, све бомбардере током операција у Сирији пратиће ловци.

[Ромејац]

[Ромејац]

Од сада, све бомбардере током операција у Сирији пратиће ловци.

 

Турци су, ако ништа друго, успели да знатно поскупе руско војно ангажовање у Сирији

[Milan Nikolic]

20:09 - Генералштаб: Русија успоставила директну телефонску везу с Министарством одбране Турске која се испоставила као бесмислена.

 

[Ignjatije]

Sta ce biti, sankcije? Ili mozda pomoc Kurdima u vidu oruzja? Sumnjam da nesto drasticnije mogu/smeju da urade.

 

Могу драстичне ствари да ураде, али не желе. Могу да спале целу Турску ако желе за неколико минута. Само што је та цена превисока за ову провокацију. Али нешто ће сигурно да ураде по овом питању. Неће им остати дужни. Видећемо шта ће бити.

 

 

Спрема се нешто велико. Не може нико да ме убеди да једну "исламску државу" нису у стању да униште Амери, Руси, Французи, НАТО... за оволико времена. Нити ме ико може убедити да овај авион није оборен уз дозволу НАТОа са неким циљем. Нити је ИД толико моћна, нити је руски авион био претња Турској. Кува се нешто гадно..... по нас обичне грађане гадно. А за владаре изгледа неопходно и нужно.

[Ромејац]

Карта турских тврдњи

[Ромејац]

Увећани приказ где су руски авиони наводно прелетели турски ваздушни простор

[Дејан]

Bilo bi glupo da Rusi sada odgovore, strpiće se da Turci naprave neku veću grešku ili greške

[Ромејац]

Приказ куда су летели руски авиони (или авион), руске тврдње

 

Плава линија показује путању турског борбеног авиона (повредио је ваздушни простор Сирије).

[Православни Србин]

 

Нисам могао да одолим. Шалу на страну, али ово јесте био отворени турски удар на Русију. Турска ће морати да сноси последице тога.

[МилошБГ]

Bilo bi glupo da Rusi sada odgovore, strpiće se da Turci naprave neku veću grešku ili greške

ne bi bilo glupo,mislim da Putin u ovom trenutku ima dva pravca i da ta dva pravca podjednako mogu biti ispravna i opravdana.

 

1. da odgovore jasno na isti nacin,niko normalan im ne bi ni rec prigovorio niti bi mogao,ovo je konkretan napad na Rusiju.

2.da spasi svet i ne odgovori na isti nacin,i da mu mi obicni ljudi budemo zahvalni i da ga svakodnevno pominjemo u molitvama.

[Ромејац]

Statement by the NATO Secretary General after the extraordinary NAC meeting

 

The North Atlantic Council has just held a meeting, an extraordinary meeting. And we have been updated by the Turkish Ambassador on the recent events. I have also spoken to Prime Minister Ahmet Davutoglu.

 

 

 

Turkey informed Allies about the downing of a Russian Air Force plane violating Turkish airspace.

I have previously expressed my concerns about the implications of the military actions of the Russian Federation close to NATO’s borders.

This highlights the importance of having and respecting arrangements to avoid such incidents in the future.

As we have repeatedly made clear, we stand in solidarity with Turkey and support the territorial integrity of our NATO Ally, Turkey.

We will continue to follow the developments on the South-Eastern borders of NATO very closely. 

I look forward to further contacts between Ankara and Moscow and I call for calm and de-escalation.

Diplomacy and de-escalation are important to resolve this situation.

Now I’m ready to take your questions.

Q (CNN): The Russians are saying the plane was shot down over Syrian territory and never went into Turkish territory. Are you convinced that it was shot down indeed over Turkish airspace and that Turkish airspace was indeed violate?

Secretary General: The Allied assessments we have got from several Allies during the day are consistent with information we have been provided with from Turkey. So the information we have from other Allies is consistent with what we have got from Turkey.

Q (Kurdish media): Mr Stoltenberg, how could be the situation and your position if tension between Russia and Turkey raised? You said that you are continue looking at developments. How could be your position if tensions continue to rise between Russia and Turkey? Thank you.

Secretary General:  I’ve think I’ve expressed very clearly that we are calling for calm and de-escalation. This is a serious situation. This is a situation which calls on that we all are prudent and that we all contribute to de-escalating the situation.

And that’s also the reason why I welcome further contacts between Moscow and Ankara. There has been contacts and we would welcome even more contacts. To partly to solve this concrete incident, but also to continue to work on the development and also the strengthening of mechanisms to avoid these kinds of situation in the future.

Actually, inside the Alliance we are discussing how we can develop better and improved measures for transparency, for predictability, and for risk reduction. Because we have to avoid this kind of incidents. We have to avoid that situations, incidents, accidents spiral out of control.

And therefore this is a serious situation, but I think that the new security environment we are facing along NATO borders just underlines the importance of focusing more on predictability, transparency, and different measures to reduce risks.

Q (WSJ): What does this say about the ability for Allies to work together with Russia in Syria? Are the tactics just too different? Are the targets just too different?

Secretary General: The common enemy should be ISIL. And I would welcome all efforts to fight ISIL. And it is important that all of us, also Russia, is guided by the overarching goal of defeating ISIL.

What we have seen is that most of the attacks by Russia so far has been targeted towards targets in parts of Syria where ISIL is not present. So we welcome all efforts to fight ISIL. Our common enemy is ISIL, and therefore I would also welcome all efforts to strengthen the fight against SIIL.

Q (Reuters): Wondered if you had any contacts with the Russians or planned any contacts with the Russians over this incident?

Secretary General: There has been contacts between Ankara and Moscow, Turkey and Russia but so far there has been no direct contact between NATO and Russia. But we have been in contact with Turkey, a NATO ally, which has directly been in contact with Russian authorities.

Q (unknown): Do you have any more clarity as to how the plane was actually shot down because that’s disputed, whether it be surface to surface or surface to air or ground to air missile?

Secretary General: I will be careful going too much into specifics and too much into details but what I can confirm is that the assessments we have from allies are consistent with what Turkey briefed us about earlier today.

[Ромејац]

Obama: Turkey has the right to defend itself and its airspace

 

Washington (CNN)Turkey's downing of a Russian fighter plane shouldn't lead to further wartime escalation in the region, President Barack Obama insisted at a press conference Tuesday.

But he maintained that Turkey had a right to defend its airspace and charged that Russian air activity near the Turkey-Syria border has contributed to the crisis.

"This points to an ongoing problem with the Russian operations," Obama said. "They are operating very close to a Turkish border, and they are going after moderate opposition that are supported by not only Turkey but a wide range of countries."

Turkey said Tuesday it shot down the Russian plane with a missile strike after repeated warnings to the plane that it had flown over its territory.

Saying he expected to speak with Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdoğan in the coming days to discuss the incident, Obama urged Russia and Turkey to communicate about the details of the operation in order to decrease the chance of escalation.

The downing of the Russian plane complicated Hollande's visit to the White House, where he pressed Obama for greater global cooperation on battling ISIS, including with Moscow. Obama appeared resistant to forming any new alliances in battling ISIS, saying he'd already convened more than 60 nations in a bid to curb the group's territorial gains in Iraq and Syria.

Hollande has openly called for a greater international effort to push back ISIS, whose killing spree in Paris two weeks ago was the worst terror attack on French soil in more than half a century.

 

He said Tuesday greater cooperation between the United States and Russia is required in battling ISIS, though persistent U.S. skepticism about Putin's intentions in Syria have until now prevented any significant military coordination between the two countries.

"We want to gather all countries," Hollande said. "We do not want to exclude anyone."

But he also said Russia must pledge to target ISIS terrorists instead of moderate Syrian forces opposed to the government of Bashar al-Assad, a requirement Obama also insisted upon during Tuesday's press conference.

"Russia right now is a coalition of two -- Iran and Russia -- supporting Assad," Obama said.

"Russia's the outlier," he added, noting that strikes against moderate opposition fighters "bolster the Assad regime."

Obama also cited the incident with Turkey as a reason for Russia to turn its focus to fighting only ISIS in Syria, saying that "some of those conflicts or potential for escalation are less likely to occur" if it narrowed its sights.

He said the encounter "underscores the importance of our moving the political track along as quickly as possible" when it comes to resolving the Syrian civil war, which ISIS has exploited to seize territory.

After the press conference, Vice President Joe Biden told reporters gathered in the East Room that he believed "Putin is coming to the realization that Assad should transition out."

Without any major new commitments to announce alongside Hollande, Obama instead touted a new intelligence sharing agreement announced last week that has helped France target ISIS sites in Raqqa, Syria. And he called on Europe to do more to stop the flow of foreign fighters, share passenger lists and exchange information across borders.

READ: Obama and Hollande meet: What a différence in U.S.-French relations

Calling ISIS a "scourge" that "must be defeated," Obama said the U.S. stood with France after the brutal massacre in Paris.

"We'll deliver justice to these terrorists and those who sent them," Obama said. ISIS "cannot be tolerated. It must be destroyed. And we must do it together."

Hollande's visit to Washington comes amid a spate of jet-set diplomacy for the French leader. He'll meet with Russian President Vladimir Putin on Thursday, and German Chancellor Angela Merkel Wednesday. He met in Paris with British Prime Minister David Cameron Monday.

Obama, who returned from a week-long foreign swing on Monday, made clear in the aftermath of the Paris attacks he wasn't considering a change in strategy, saying instead he was planning to intensify the U.S.-led coalition's air campaign in Iraq and Syria.

In his first press conference after the attacks, in Antalya, Turkey, Obama argued testily that alternative plans from Republicans ignored realities on the ground, saying that his own interactions with wounded troops instilled a wariness toward war.

After coming under intense criticism for his response to the attacks, Obama turned up his rhetoric on ISIS Sunday, saying during a press conference in Malaysia that his efforts to stamp out the group would succeed.

But he nonetheless departed Asia insisting the strategy he's utilized against ISIS is working -- and that other options, like sending in ground troops, aren't being considered.

The White House signaled Monday that it already believes U.S. contributions to the anti-ISIS effort are sufficient.

"The United States is certainly pulling more than our own weight when it comes to the contribution behind this coalition," White House Press Secretary Josh Earnest said. "That's something that we're glad to do. That is in line with the long tradition of American leadership. It certainly is a tradition that this president believes in."

[feeble]

ne bi bilo glupo,mislim da Putin u ovom trenutku ima dva pravca i da ta dva pravca podjednako mogu biti ispravna i opravdana.

 

1. da odgovore jasno na isti nacin,niko normalan im ne bi ni rec prigovorio niti bi mogao,ovo je konkretan napad na Rusiju.

2.da spasi svet i ne odgovori na isti nacin,i da mu mi obicni ljudi budemo zahvalni i da ga svakodnevno pominjemo u molitvama.

Kako da odgovore na isti nacin? Da cekaju da Turska upadne u njihov vazdusni prostor? Ili da ih obaraju iz Sirije kad lete u Turskoj? Mislim da im ne treba dalje zapetljavanje, pogotovo ne sa Turskom, da ne bude novi Afganistan.

[Срђан Шијакињић]

Тако предвидљиве реакције из НАТО-а и САД... Мислим да Русија нема ниједан суштински начин да реагује, сем ако Турци не уђу у Сирију или нешто слично. А и то би било ограничено на обарање неког турског авиона. Не видим шта друго Русија може да учини, у јако тешкој економској ситуацији је да би уводила некакве санкције, и да их уведе те санкције би шкодиле њој колико и Турцима, а за војну реакцију опет не видим простора, сигурно да неће да тек тако бомбардују Турску, ако Турци не дају макар некакав даљи повод.