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@Панарет Искрена препорука: ако имаш таквих проблема, обрати се митрополиту Порфирију. Можеш и владики Стефану, настојатељу Храма Св. Саве на Врачару....лакше ћеш до њега доћи.

 

Ако те занима иконопис, читај...немој се поводити будалаптинама типа "писало у новинама" или "ја глед'о, било на ТеВе-у":

 

image.png.78147bf70dc482c99c37474ea1b37d9e.png

(Добро, де...немој сад јавно овде да говориш да ме волиш...)

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Нажалост, данас и у Цркви појединци, почињу отворено да говоре у одбрану настраности хомосексуализма. Пре неки дан један тзв.теолог и вероучитељ(?!) рече како у анусу постоји мушка Г тачка, те самим тим је "сексуални" однос двојице мушкараца оправдан!? Притом је женственији од сваке жене...

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На нашу жалост, православни хришћанин НЕ читају Св. Писмо... А у њему све лепо пише... Ко је читао апостола Павла који говори о "противприродној употреби мушкараца"(1. поглавље после. Римљанима), као и посланицу Коринћанима све ће му бити јасно... Све пише у Св. Писму. Треба га читати и у њему одговоре налазити и све ће нам бити јасно... А не да лупамо и измишљамо, постављајући питање да ли је накарадна хомосексуалност грех(?!)...

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nažalost stvari su malo komplikovanije nego što to izgleda na prvi pogled, smatram da imamo hipokriziju "borbe za ljudska prava". 

ja bi bio prvi koji bi se saglasio i ako treba protestvovao da se (zajedno sa) homoseksualcima daju sva prava, pre svega pravo na bezbednost pa na bračnog druga, imovinu, antidiskriminaciju itd... to što ja po verskim ubeđenjima to smatam za greh je potpuno druga stvar... ali jednostavno oni kao i ja pred državom koja je zadužena za regulisanje tih odnosa moraju da se osećaju dostojanstveno i punopravno.

međutim nažalost primećujem da su razni pokreti "borbaša za prava" (ne samo LGBT) namerno radikalizovani i tako vođeni da se potpuno umanji šansa za ostvarenje proklamovanih ciljeva. stvar je vrlo jednostavna razna udruženja i NVO-je koje dobijaju novac u vidu grantova i čiji promoteri žive od toga sasvim sigurno žele da što duže glume "ulogu žrtve" jer samo u toj ulozi njihova "borba" i novac za nju su sigurni. onog trenutka kada se reše sva sporna pitanja, njihovo postojanje (i pare) prestaju da imaju smisla. zato je radikalizacija 8u vidu konkretnih zahteva ili provocirajućih nastupa) vrlo poželjna stvar jer uz radikalizovane zahteve oni osiguravaju poziciju kako njih društvo ne prihvata. dakle vrlo vešto balansiraju između sa jedne strane zaista tužnih i za svakog normalnog čoveka empatičnih priča o nasilju (koje svakako ne treba da postoji) a sa druge strane namernog "zabadanja prsta u oko" extremnim zahtevima ili performansima čime osiguravaju da budu "žrtva" što duže.

sve u svemu hipokrizija najviše šteti samim homoseksualcima koji nisu "radno angažovani" na borbi za ljudska prava jer veštački udaljavaju i ono što bi se realno moglo postići. 

obrni okreni uvek se dolazi do onoga koliko je čovek iskren u onome čime se bavi, tako i ovaj gornji video sasvim sigurno bog prašta i greh homoseksualizma i niko od nas nije pozvan da sudi homoseksualcima, međutim taj greh crkva nikada neće odobriti makar on bio i urođen (kao sklonost) i na žalost to sami homoseksualci znaju, ali kao što rekoh iz drugih razloga "guraju tu priču".

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Верујем да људи са таквим проблемом могу да нађу Господа и без овог светогрђа.

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Управо сада, Драгана Милошевић рече

Верујем да људи са таквим проблемом могу да нађу Господа и без овог светогрђа.

Свако може да нађе Господа, уствари не мора ни да Га тражи, Он је у свакоме, треба Га само хтети. Дотични не траже Господа, погтово не овим светогрђем, дотични траже своја "права". Уствари њихова права нису угрожена, они угрожавају друге, и намећу свој сатанизам : парламенту, у Владу, у законодавство и, ево, сад и у Цркву.

То они траже...уствари инсистирају на агрсиван начин, исти онај начин линча, као када су дошли пред врата Лота.

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Чињеница је да су хомосексуалци одувек били у самом срцу Цркве, то није лако сварити, али то је истина.

Лепо је то описао брат @Дејан Мачковић  https://www.academia.edu/28900667/ОДНОС_СПЦ_ПРЕМА_ГЕЈ_ПОПУЛАЦИЈИ_КАО_КУЛТУРОЛОШКОМ_ФЕНОМЕНУ.pdf 

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пре 5 минута, Срђан К. рече

@ПанаретТи, брате, са Његошевом сликом оправдаваш грех, болест и настраност...? Бар склони Његоша...

Ја управо када говорим о овим стварима осећам благодатно и живо присуство св. митрополита Петра II Петровића Његоша, цетињског пустињака и ловћенског тајновидца...

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@ПанаретДа, управу си, Његош је сигурно тако мислио... Он је био пионир у заштити хомосексуализма још у 19.веку. Опрости, ја заборавио ту чињеницу...

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Ја управо када говорим о овим стварима осећам благодатно и живо присуство св. митрополита Петра II Петровића Његоша, цетињског пустињака и ловћенског тајновидца...

Боже ти сачувај.

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пре 26 минута, Панарет рече

Чињеница је да су хомосексуалци одувек били у самом срцу Цркве, то није лако сварити, али то је истина.

Лепо је то описао брат @Дејан Мачковић  https://www.academia.edu/28900667/ОДНОС_СПЦ_ПРЕМА_ГЕЈ_ПОПУЛАЦИЈИ_КАО_КУЛТУРОЛОШКОМ_ФЕНОМЕНУ.pdf 

Nazalost ima dosta netacnih stvari, kojih je uzrok ovo.... " Осим тога, оним епископима СПЦ који се из хобија баве геј тематиком,непозната је хришћанска литература са Запада, како конзервативна, тако и либерална, која говори о овој теми затим аргументи из биологије, генетике, као и нова истраживања и разумијевања Светог писма и хришћанског Предања у свјетлу нових аргумената и новог доба..."

I, recimo, ta nova istrazivanja idu ovako...." Прије свега епизода с посјетом тројице анђела Лоту у Содому. Све касније библијске референце на ову тему, под Содомским гријехом не подразумијевају хомосексуалност, него негостољубље. У Библији Содома стоји као антипод гостољубљу Аврамовом...."

Mislim, ono, niste znali dragi moji hriscani da se sodom i gomor u stvari odnosi na pojam negostoljublja.... :D ...jeste da nije lepo biti negostoljubiv ali da je to kako kaze prorok Jezekilj za Sodom.... Него се понашаху и чињаху гадове преда мном, за то их затрх кад видех.....(Jezekilj. 16, 50)... mislio prorok na negostoljublje,.... onda smo svi ugasili nacisto... :smeh1:

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постоје у Сибиру неколико казамата који су запуштени, дефинитивно их треба активирати поново. 

п.с. овај интернет је тотално луда ствар, омогућава сваком "дупету" да искаже своје мишљење. жалосно какве замене теза читам овде... 

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Писали смо доста пута о овоме, тешка тема... Морамо имати пуно разумевања за хомосекс. који желе да живе црквено. Замислите само колико хетеро људи би остало у Цркви када би то подразумевало да морају да се одрекну не само секса целог живота, него и могућности да нађу мужа/жену, тј. романтичну љубав, са свим што таква љубав подразумева, икада у животу... Верујем да би остало мало више људи него што тренутно има монаха и искушеника.

С друге стране, поштено говорећи, не видим пуно простора за аргументацију да практиковање хомосексуалности није грех. Просто нема пуно места (ако их има уопште) у Писму и Предању на која би се могло позвати. Према томе, по мом мишљењу, највише што се може је да се у пракси верујућим хомосексуалцима изађе у сусрет, тако што би свештеници са посебном предусретљивошћу процењивали сваки појединачни случај и што не би потпуно забрањивали причешћивање и учествовање у црквеном животу оним хомосексуалцима који верују, желе да буду део Цркве, али нису довољно снажни да се - још увек - обавежу на целибат или, још важније и много теже, одрекну потребе да буду са неким у емотивној вези. Замислите случајеве у којима две особе проведу у вези године и године, у чврстој, моногамној вези пуној љубави и онда неко од њих осети потребу да верује и да живи црквено (као што се дешава маси хетеро особа у неком тренутку у животу)... Шта таква особа треба да ради? Да прекине све везе са дојучерашњим животним партнером? Ужасно тешко, практично немогуће очекивати тако нешто од било кога...

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Ова тема је за сада закључана и нису омогућени будући одговори.

  • Сличан садржај

    • Од Vladan :::.,
      У петак 25. октобра у 16:30 у Саборном храму светих апостола Петра и Павла у Јагодини биће дочек и освећење иконе Светог Нектарија Егинског, као и поклоњење моштима овог светитеља. Након тога Његово Преосвештенство Епископ шумадијски Господин Јован служиће акатист великом Егинском чудотворцу.
       
       
       
    • Од Bernard,
      Greek Fathers on Petrine Texts of the New Testament
                                                                           
      The Greeks were consistently interpreting the 3 passages (Matt 16, John 21, Luke 22) as pertaining to Peter’s primacy, and via inheritance, the prerogative of Peter’s chair. Below is a Florilegium of Greek interpretation from the 5th to 9th centuries:
        St. +Cyril of Alexandria, writing in his commentary on the gospel according to St. Matthew (444), says, “that by the words ‘on this rock I shall build my church’, Christ makes Peter its Pastor, literally he places Peter over it as shepherd” – Ταύτης ποιμένα τόν Πέτρον έφίστησω (Patrologia Graeca 72, 423)   St. + Gregory of Nyssa, spoke in a recorded sermon (395) saying that Peter is the head of the Church, “According to the privilege granted him by the Lord, Peter is that unbreakable and most solid rock upon which the Savior built His church” – ή άρραγής καί όχυρωτάτη πέτρα έφ ήν τήν Έκκλησίαν ό Σωτήρ ώκοδόμησε (Patrologia Graeca 46, 733)   St. John Chrysostom taught that St. Peter was the “leader of the Apostles” in his 88th homily in St. John’s gospel (PG 59, 478), and even went further than this. In his 5th homily on “Penitence”, Chrysostom writes that after Peter had been restored to his former apostleship after committing the three-fold denial, he was also given “jurisdiction over the universal church” (PG 49, 308).   Again, in his 8th discourse on the Jews, he writes on how the repentance of Peter wiped out his fault and , “he becomes again head of the Apostles and the whole world is committed to his care” (PG 48, 951)   During the Monophysite fall out in the East, there were bishops who were strongly Chalcedonian, and thus, wished above all to retain the communion of the Apostolic See. A famous letter of appeal was written to Rome, and these Greeks openly declared the following about Pope Symmachus (512 AD):   “…but for the precious salvation not only of the East, but of three parts almost of the inhabited world, redeemed, not with corruptible gold or silver, but with the precious blood of the Lamb of God, according to the doctrine of the blessed prince of the glorious Apostles, whose See Christ, the Good Shepherd, has entrusted to your blessedness….You have not only received the power of binding, but also that of loosing, in accordance with the example of the Master, those who long have been in bonds, nor only the power of uprooting and of destroying, but also that of planting and rebuilding, as Jeremias, or rather, as Jesus Christ, of whom Jeremias was the type….You are not ignorant of this malice, you whom Peter, your blessed Doctor, teaches always to shepherd, not by violence but by an authority fully accepted, the sheep of Christ which are entrusted to you in all the habitable world.” (Mansi viii. 221)   “Two bishop of Thessalonica wrote the following to Pope Boniface II (521): “For these things we appeal to your blessedness and the Apostolic See, and through it we believe we hear and adore thrice blessed Peter, and the chief Shepherd of the Church, Christ our Lord” (Mansi, viii, 748)   Patriarch St. Sophronius of Jerusalem had commissioned St. Stephen of Dor to appeal to the Roman See in order to procure the condemnation of the Monothelites occupying the Eastern Patriarchates. Stephen describes this aloud at the Council of Lateran 649:   ““And for this cause, sometimes we asked for water to our head and to our eyes a fountain of tears, sometimes the wings of a dove, according to holy David, that we might fly away and announce these things to the Chair which rules and presides over all, I mean to yours, the Head and Highest, for the healing of the whole wound. For this it has been accustomed to do from of old and from the beginning with power by its canonical and apostolical authority, because the truly great Peter , head of the Apostles, was clearly thought worthy not only to be entrusted with the keys of heaven, alone apart from the rest, to open it worthily to believers, or to close it justly to those who disbelieve the gospel of grace, but because he was also first commissioned to feed the sheep of the whole Catholic Church; for ‘Peter’, said He, ‘Do you love me? Feed my sheep’, and again , because he had in a manner peculiar and special, a faith in the Lord stronger than all and unchangeable, to be converted and to confirm his fellows and spiritual brethren when tossed about, as having been adorned by God himself, incarnate for us, with power and sacerdotal authority…I was urged by the requests of almost all the pious bishops of the East in agreement with the departed Sophronius…Without delay I made this journey for this purpose alone; and since then thrice have I run to you Apostolic Feet, urging and beseeching the prayer of Sophronius and of all, that is, that you will assist the imperiled faith of Christians”” (Acts of Lateran Synod 649, Richard Price)   St. Theodore the Studite (+826) wrote a letter to Pope Paschal I, and in it reads:   “Hear me, O Head of the Apostles, placed by God as Shepherd of the Sheep of Christ, holder of the keys of the kingdom of heaven, the rock of faith on which the Catholic Church has been built. For you are Peter; you adorn the throne of Peter and rule from it” (PG 99-1151).   And as insincere as one would like to think it is, the words of Photius the Great (9th century) to Pope John VIII:   “We may well ask who is the Master who has taught you to act in this fashion? — surely, above all, it is Peter, the leader of the Apostles whom the Lord has placed at the head of all the churches, when He said to him: ‘Feed my sheep’. ” (Mansi 17, 396D; MGH, Epp. VII, 167) https://erickybarra.org/2017/03/10/the-greeks-on-matthew-16-john-21-and-luke-23/
    • Од Ромејац,
      Met. Chrysostomos of Dodoni (right) with Pat. Bartholomew (left)
       
      Several Moscow Patriarchate hierarchs and clergy went on pilgrimage recently to the Greek Ionian Islands, where they had a chance to meet with the Greek hierarchs of Zakynthos and Dodoni and to discuss current Orthodox events.
      During the course of the conversation, His Eminence Metropolitan Chrysostomos of Dodoni expressed his views on the Ukrainian issue, revealing the influence of the Patriarchate of Constantinople’s particular understanding of the issue on certain hierarchs in the Greek Church.
      On Sunday, September 15, His Eminence Metropolitan Isidore of Smolensk and His Grace Bishop Seraphim of Bobruisk of the Belarusian Exarchate and two accompanying priests were warmly welcomed at the Monastery of Strofades and St. Dionysios in Zakynthos by His Eminence Metropolitan Dionysios II of Zakynthos and His Eminence Metropolitan Chrysostomos of Dodoni, formerly the hierarch of Zakynthos, reports nyxthimeron.com.
      After visiting the sepulchral church of St. Dionysius, the guests toured the ecclesiastical museum, exchanged gifts, and were served a rich meal, during which Met. Chrysostomos, who has served as a bishop since 1976, expressed his nostalgic love for the two former Patriarchs of Moscow, with whom he had close ties, as well as several other historical figures of the Russian Church.
      However, the metropolitan revealed another attitude towards the Russian Church when the guests broached the topic of the ongoing Ukrainian crisis. “With the boldness that distinguishes him, [he] pointed out that any problem could have been raised and solved at the Holy and Great Council of Crete (2016) if the Moscow Patriarchate had not refused, with various excuses, to attend, thereby sabotaging unanimity and unity, and even compelling other Churches. This is because Russia always has aspirations of being ‘Third Rome,’” nyxthimeron.com reports.
      Whether Met. Chrysostomos has simply grown fuzzy on the details in the years since the Council or whether he was intentionally distorting the timeline is unclear.
      The Bulgarian Orthodox Church announced on June 1, 2016 that it would not attend the Council; the Antiochian Church announced on June 6 that it would not attend; and the Georgian Orthodox Church announced on June 10 that it would not attend. Only after these three Churches had withdrawn did the Russian Church announce that it could not attend.
      Moreover, the Churches did not simply withdraw, but rather called for the council to be postponed so that their respective issues could be addressed. The Moscow Patriarchate specifically proposed holding an emergency pre-conciliar session for just this purpose, but Patriarch Bartholomew refused to do so, choosing instead to plow ahead with the council without full pan-Orthodox unity.
      While the Patriarchate of Constantinople blames the Russian Church for influencing the other Churches to withdraw, this has always remained groundless speculation, as are paranoid fears of a “Third Rome” ecclesiology. A position of respect for the other Local Churches allows them to speak for themselves, and each of the Churches expressed their own seriously-considered reasons for withdrawing from the Council.
      And despite Met. Chrysostomos’ contention, the Ukrainian issue would not have been addressed at Crete even had the Russian Church attended, as Pat. Bartholomew publicly acknowledged already in January of 2016 that it was not on the agenda. The official agenda for the Crete Council was published on January 28, and also did not include the topic of autocephaly and how to grant it.
      Pat. Bartholomew has referred to the fact that autocephaly was not dealt with at Crete to justify his claim to the right to grant autocephaly whenever to whomever, wherever.
      Meeting with the Russian hierarchs, the Metropolitan of Dodoni also stated that every nation has the right to self-determination and to Church autocephaly. Recall, however, that the Patriarchate of Constantinople claims large chunks of Greece for itself, thus there are two Local Churches operating within one nation.
      Met. Chrysostomos also noted that autocephaly is typically given by the Patriarchate of Constantinople, as was the case with Russia, Greece, Serbia, Romania, and Bulgaria. It should be noted, however, that those territories were within the jurisdiction of the Patriarchate of Constantinople before they received autocephaly, whereas Ukraine has not been part of Constantinople for more than 300 years. Moreover, the Georgian Church received its ancient autocephaly from the Patriarchate of Antioch.
      Concerning the Russian clerics disquiet concerning “Patriarch” Philaret Denisenko, Met. Chrysostomos again insisted that everything could have been settled if not for the Russian Church’s efforts to “torpedo” any pan-Orthodox council. Recall that His Beatitude Patriarch John X of Antioch, and many other primates, hierarchs, and Synods, specifically called upon Pat. Bartholomew to summon a pan-Orthodox council to deal with the Ukrainian issue, and Pat. Bartholomew flatly refused, citing the failure of the Crete council.
      The Greek hierarch also criticized the Russian Church for ceasing Eucharistic communion with the Patriarchate of Constantinople, though reports did not mention if he detailed how he thinks a Church should respond to another Local Church non-canonically invading its territory and setting up schismatics as a new church.
      Met. Chrysostomos concluded with a very revealing remark, noting that the Church of Greece is of the same ethnicity and race as the Patriarchate of Constantinople, and thus it is inconceivable for it not to align itself with Constantinople.
      The Greek metropolitan is echoing the sentiment of Pat. Bartholomew and the Patriarchate of Constantinople with such remarks. Certain Greek and Ukrainian media outlets have repeatedly framed the Ukrainian issue as “Russia vs. Ukraine”
      or “Russia vs. Constantinople,” rather than considering it through the lens of Orthodoxy.
      In October of last year, Pat. Bartholomew himself declared that “Our Slavic brothers cannot tolerate the primacy of the Ecumenical Patriarchate and our nation in Orthodoxy,” and “Whether our Russian brothers like it or not, sooner or later, they will follow the decisions of the Ecumenical Patriarch, because they have no other choice.”
      A similar attitude was displayed recently when Metropolitan Ephraim of Hydra, Spetses, and Aegina threatened to canonically punish three clerics who had written a letter of support to His Beatitude Metropolitan Onuphry of Kiev and All Ukraine. Viewing the matter as one of ethnic enmity rather than one of holy Orthodoxy, the metropolitan interpreted their support for Met. Onuphry as a declaration of loyalty to the Moscow Patriarchate, rather than as the declaration of loyalty to the sacred canons of which they wrote.
      Such an attitude stands in stark contrast to that of many other hierarchs, including His Holiness Patriarch Irinej of the Serbian Orthodox Church, who recently spoke of how the Serbian Church is autocephalous and equal to all the other autocephalous Churches, as racial or ethnic superiority has no place in the Church of Christ.
       
      Greek hierarch: We are the same race as Constantinople, we must side with the Patriarchate
      ORTHOCHRISTIAN.COM Several Moscow Patriarchate hierarchs and clergy went on pilgrimage recently to the Greek Ionian Islands, where they had a chance to meet with the Greek hierarchs of Zakynthos and...  

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